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Assisted Killing in Scotland

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  • Graham
    replied
    Ok Sue, please explain how?

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  • SueM
    replied
    What assisted dying allows is for a terminally ill patient, who might otherwise have lingered on for weeks in agony, slowly starving or suffocating, to go out in a condition they want their families to remember: lucid, comfortable and free of suffering.
    Not my words but from a ‘Dignity in Dying’ post on Facebook

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  • Graham
    replied
    I really can't imagine that law-makers could possibly legalise assisted killings. It would open up Pandora's Box with Care Homes being able to interpret the law in ever despicable ways.

    Given that our breathing is most likely to fail, I totally understand that some of us want an exit before it gets too distressing. I can think back to people on this forum that really suffered but some went peacefully. I guess age may be a factor.

    Before Shipman and social media, doctors were known to make people 'comfortable'. This is the remit of the palliative care teams but some are way better than others. I was able to insist on more and more sedative in the driver in the last day of a parent at the hospice.

    Other people on Build-UK forum built up a supply of sedatives, but I am not sure what is a lethal dose.


    That's it from me - back to the app.

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  • matthew55
    replied
    That's why considerate people do it in private.

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  • denise
    replied
    I totally agree. There was also the case of the guy driving his car onto the railway crossing in front of a train. He killed himself and killed and injured passengers.

    my brother had a few attempts. One driving his car into a roundabout unfortunately with his kids in the back. Cutting his wrists, locking himself in the garage in his car with the engine running. He managed it in the end.

    if people can't be helped and it's what they want at least it won't be at the risk of others.

    what about that pilot that crashed his plane with all those people on board!

    😟

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  • DJW
    replied
    At one point in my career I worked for the emergency response unit for the London underground. At the time on average one person a week would jump in front of a train. A "one under" or PUT Person Under Train.


    It was a hot July and the call came through, one under at Earls court, Piccadilly Line. I came down onto the platform the train was half in the tunnel and halfway along the platform.


    The driver was visibly in shock and was whisked away for an immediate drug and alcohol testing. Standard procedure.


    There was groaning coming from under one of the carriages. I climbed down to track between the two carriages. Immediately I was stuck buy the pungent smell of blood.


    There is a deep recess in the platform grounds fondly known as the suicide pit. The gap between the bottom of a train and track formation is very small and a body would be by crushed if it were not for the suicide pit.


    There before me, was a woman in her 80s wearing a summer dress. Her femur was broken and protruding threw her leg. Her arm was broken and her hand was pointing a different direction. Deep gash on her forehead and I could see her skull bone.


    I asked her if she remembered what had happened and she replied she jumped in front of the train. We loaded her onto a stretcher and pulled out from under the train.


    The helicopter emergency medical service (HEMS) flew her to hospital. Not only had her suicide attempt been unsuccessful, but she also seriously and adversely affected the mental health of the driver of the train. There is also so that cost for her medical care and the helicopter flight and rescue.


    Graham Would not it have been more humane for her and everybody else her decision to kill herself by jumping in front of a train to have the assisted dying option?

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  • denise
    replied
    Well said Linda. It's good to discuss things.
    😊

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  • LindaB
    replied
    For now we have the option of an advanced decision/living will to decline life sustaining treatment.

    I think it's about choice - a very personal decision. A legal framework would ensure all the correct checks were made in all situations. Including if necessary judicial hearings.
    No one should have to check out of their life earlier than they would want to simply because they need to be able to board a plane & have the funds to pay a private clinic.

    We all deserve a good death whatever that may mean to us.

    Ps I'm not depressed these were my views pre diagnosis

    Graham thanks for starting the topic it will always be contentious and there will be very many differing and valid views.
    ​​​​

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  • Graham
    replied
    The status quo allows a carer, true friend, partner, wife or husband to administer a lethal dose, however that person will be subject to a criminal investigation. I have been looking out for cases on the news over the years and the only one that I noticed, the elderly long-standing husband got a suspended sentence. It is only possible to take each case on its merits. A suspended sentence is no price to pay for love. Things could be improved with the status quo. An explicit, witnessed request to die. Doctor's advice on a pain-free death.

    Legalising assisted killing is a non-starter. It incentivises killing with no legal framework for any comeback. I can imagine some horror stories quietly unfolding in Oregon USA. It is a very slippy slope to much worse. Care homes will pretty quickly become Killing homes.

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  • kd1
    replied
    I live in Scotland, support the proposed bill, have absolute confidence in my family, am not depressed, but fear there might be so many limitations built in the bill, assisted dying might be hard to access.What I want is a choice so that if I live on, I'm actively choosing that; obviously many of us will differ and I respect that.

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  • SueM
    replied
    It’s very emotive to call it assisted killing! We are way behind in this country with legislation to support assisted dying, and I’m sure that when it is allowed there will be so many checks in place to make sure there is no pressure from carers and family members.

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  • matthew55
    replied
    We are born to die simples 👍xx

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  • denise
    replied
    Let's be honest we are all going to die. Some of us would like to decide when.

    I think this conversation is difficult and Scotland hasn't made it law.

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  • DJW
    replied
    Oh the irony! That is exactly what is going on, our bodies are on a path of self destruction. Eventually we all will snuff ourselves out, mostly with suffocation and not by hanging but by type 2 respiratory failure.

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  • PeterPan
    replied
    Originally posted by Graham View Post
    Peter, I am guessing you want to be able to kill yourself when the time comes?

    Have you enquired with your GP how you can 'make yourself comfortable'?

    You should be able to acquire enough morphine to last a week or two under the current rules.
    I don’t want to engage in this conversation any more, thank you.

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